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Articles: TP Features | | jArjiyan&#` bhAShalO telugu | |
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| July 29, 2006
Report from the U.S.
N.S. Rajaram
In the rewriting of Indian history that is currently underway, the Seminar on Aryan/Non-Aryan Contributions held on June 23 – 25 at the Center of Indic Studies, University of Massachusetts, Dartmouth is likely to prove seminal. At the Seminar, now becoming known as the Dartmouth Conference, advocates of the Aryan theories, including the Aryan invasion, were forced to confront data from a wide range of sources including historical, astronomical, genetic and archaeological that simply could not be brushed away by appealing to linguistics.
Most telling of all was the genetic evidence pointing to the fact that Indians have lived where they are today for the better part of 50,000 years and no Aryan invasion took place. The genetic data was presented by two leading workers in the field— Dr. Peter Underhill of Stanford University and Dr. V.K. Kashyap of the National Institute of Biologicals of New Delhi. Their findings overwhelmingly contradict the notion of any Aryan invasion and/or migration for the origin of Indian civilization.
These findings had been anticipated and summarized (based or earlier data) in the just released book Sarasvati River and the Vedic Civilization by N.S. Rajaram (Aditya Prakashan). The book was circulated at the Conference and attracted wide attention. Its author actively participated in the Conference.
Dr. B.B. Lal, India’s seniormost archaeologist, made a masterly presentation summarizing the whole gamut of archaeological discoveries from the Sarasvati river to the various Harappan sites pointing out how they bear the stamp of Vedic ideas and thoroughly contradict the Aryan invasion. Rajaram highlighted the fact that the Rigveda came before the Harappan civilization, and Harappan archaeology belongs to later phase of the Vedic civilization, the period that produced the Brahmanas, Upanishads and the Sutras.
All this means that Harappan archaeology records the material remains of the Vedic civilization, especial of the later phase, when the ideas found the Veda Samhitas saw exposition, consolidation and codification in the Vedantic literature. This is clear from the Vedic symbols like the svastika, om, ashvattha leaves and others found on Harappan artifacts especially the seals.
Rajaram pointed out that it had long been known that the Aryan invasion theory was a political creation. This had later been embraced by academics, especially in the West, who now feel threatened by new discoveries. In particular, he showed that the British themselves acknowledged that it was used to make their rule acceptable to Indians. In support Rajaram cited the British Prime Minister Stanley Baldwin’s statement in the House of Commons in 1929:
“Now, after ages, …the two branches of the great Aryan ancestry have again been brought together by Providence… By establishing British rule in India, God said to the British, “I have brought you and the Indians together after a long separation, …it is your duty to raise them to their own level as quickly as possible …brothers as you are…”
This highlighted the preposterous claims of the Aryan theories and brought much laughter. The audience agreed that after this disclosure no one could take these Aryan theories seriously. It was also agreed that after the fall of the Aryan invasion theory, a major topic on the research agenda should be to dispel the dogma that tries to make the Harappan civilization non-Vedic, by studying Harappan archaeology alongside the Vedic and Vedantic literature.
An interesting aspect of the Dartmouth Conference was the joint presence of the Harvard linguist Michael Witzel, a strong proponent of the Aryan theories, and its opponents, notably scientist and historian N.S. Rajaram and archaeologist B.B. Lal. The evidence against the Aryan theories presented by these two (and other participants) was so strong that Witzel for the first time stated in public that he and his colleagues no longer subscribed to the Aryan invasion theory.
At the same time he (and his supporters) are not prepared to give up the idea of the foreign origin of the Indian civilization. This position, as just noted, is easily refuted by a closer study of Harappan artifacts combined with scientific data from natural history, genetics and astronomy.
The date of 1500 B.C. for the Rigveda has also been demolished by astronomical studies using the latest planetary software and celestial-mechanical models. Dr. Narahari Achar, an astrophysicist from The University of Memphis clearly showed with astronomical analysis that the Mahabharata war in 3,067 BC that refutes the idea of an outside Aryan origin of Vedic people dating to 1500 BC. Since Bharata, mentioned in Rigveda was the ancestor of the heroes of the Mahabharata, the Vedas must be much older.
A sour note was introduced by the somewhat abrasive conduct of Michael Witzel who was present but did not present his findings though invited to do so by the organizers. His public behavior, which went to the extent of passing nasty personal comments on speakers, including on some young people who had traveled from different parts of the country left a bad taste in the mouth of the participants. In his press statement (see Appendix below) Dr. Balram Singh was moved to comment:
“Witzel while refusing to present his own data and evidence for his theories despite being invited to do so was nevertheless present for part of the conference, and raised many questions. Some of his personal commentaries questioning the credibility of scholars evoked sharp responses from other participants.” Dr. Singh further stated that he was “appalled at the level of visceral feelings Witzel holds against some of the scholars in the field, but felt satisfied with the overall outcome of the conference.”
Speaking personally, as a veteran of many conferences in both science and technology areas and in the humanities like history and literature, I found Witzel’s public behavior, especially towards young people, to be unbecoming of a scholar of his seniority and standing. I could not help contrasting his behavior with that of my late colleague, the great Vedic scholar and paleographer Dr. Natwar Jha, who never said an unkind word about anyone, and always prefaced any criticism with a statement about a similar error that he himself had committed.
It is of course absurd to compare a true scholar and gentleman like Jha with Witzel, but it struck me since the memory of my eminent colleague who passed away in May was still fresh. In truth it is as absurd as comparing St. Francis of Assissi and Attila the Hun.
APPENDIX: Press release
University of Massachusetts Dartmouth, Center for Indic Studies
Press Release, July 3, 2006
Scientists Collide with Linguists to Assert Indigenous origin of Indian Civilization
Comprehensive population genetics data along with archeological and astronomical evidence presented at June 23-25, 2006 conference in Dartmouth, MA, overwhelmingly concluded that Indian civilization and its human population is indigenous.
In fact, the original people and culture within the Indian Subcontinent may even be a likely pool for the genetic, linguistic, and cultural origin of the most rest of the world, particularly Europe and Asia.
Leading evidences come from population genetics, which were presented by two leading researchers in the field, Dr. V. K. Kashyap, National Institute of Biologicals, India, and Dr. Peter Underhill of Stanford University in California. Their results generally contradict the notion of Aryan invasion/migration theory for the origin of Indian civilization.
Underhill concluded: “…the spatial frequency distributions of both L1 frequency and variance levels show a spreading pattern emanating from India, referring to a Y chromosome marker.” He, however, put several caveats before interpreting genetic data, including Y-ancestry may not always reflect the ancestry of the rest of the genome.
Dr. Kashyap, on the other hand, with the most comprehensive set of genetic data (of both mtDNA and Y-chromosome) was quite emphatic in his assertion that there is “no clear genetic evidence for an intrusion of Indo-Aryan people into India, [and] establishment of caste system and gene flow.”
Michael Witzel, a Harvard linguist, who is known to lead the idea of Aryan invasion/migration/influx theory in more recent times, continued to question genetic evidence on the basis that it does not provide the time resolution to explain events that may have been involved in Aryan presence in India.
Dr. Kashyap’s reply was that even though the time resolution needs further work, the fact that there are clear and distinct differences in the gene pools of Indian population and those of Central Asian and European groups, the evidence nevertheless negates any Aryan invasion or migration into Indian Subcontinent.
Witzel while refusing to present his own data and evidence for his theories despite being invited to do so was nevertheless present for part of the conference, and raised many questions. Some of his personal commentaries questioning the credibility of scholars evoked sharp responses from other participants.
Rig Veda has been dated to 1,500 BC by those who use linguistics to claim its origin Aryans coming out of Central Asia and Europe. Archaeologist B.B. Lal, and scientist and historian N.S. Rajaram disagreed with the position of linguists, in particular of Witzel, who claimed literary and linguistic evidence for the non-Indian origin of the Vedic civilization. Lal and Rajaram disputed this on scientific, literary and historical grounds.
Dr. Narahari Achar, a physicist from The University of Memphis clearly showed with astronomical analysis that the Mahabharata war in 3,067 BC, thus poking a major hole in the outside Aryan origin of Vedic people dating to 1500 BC.
Interestingly, Witzel stated, for the first time to many in the audience, that he and his colleagues no longer subscribe to Aryan invasion theory, though he continues to hold to a foreign origin for the people and civilization of India. As noted previously, he presented no data in support of his position though invited to do so by the organizers.
Dr. Bal Ram Singh, Director, Center for Indic Studies at UMass Dartmouth, which organized the conference was appalled at the level of visceral feelings Witzel holds against some of the scholars in the field, but felt satisfied with the overall outcome of the conference.
“I am glad to see people who have been scholarly shooting at each other for about a decade are finally in one room, and this should be counted as progress,” said Singh in conclusion.
The conference brought together in one room for the first time experts from genetics, archeology, physics, linguistics, anthropology, history, and philosophy. A proceedings of the conference is expected to come out soon, detailing various arguments on the origin of Indian civilization.
Posted by: Malakpet Rowdy At: 17, Dec 2007 8:04:15 AM IST
Posted by: Mr. Ken Veerla At: 17, Dec 2007 6:33:02 AM IST
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But I do have interest in talking about the lies being spread out by proponents of Aryan Invasion Theory .. and also in a person who feels its insulting to have a name like 'VENKATAPPAYYA', talk big about Telugu!
Of course running away when the questions are raised is one of 'His' qualities! This can not be a coincidence :))
Posted by: Malakpet Rowdy At: 17, Dec 2007 7:56:06 AM IST
WELL SAID GOPI KUMAR!!!!!
ANACONDA and KONDA chiluva .. Why cant we call Telugu a PROTO-AMAZONIAN language?
Posted by: Malakpet Rowdy At: 16, Dec 2007 10:13:57 PM IST
Posted by: Mr. Ken Veerla At: 16, Dec 2007 6:20:41 PM IST
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Badnaam is a Urdu word, Not a Classical Hindi one ..
Upar in Hindi means ABOVE .. not UPPER
Andar means INSIDE not below
Kallak in Gujarati/Hindi is directly imported from English .. just like rODDu in Telugu
....
About Aryan-Dravidian stuff ... Haven't you read the responses I posted? Lemme repeat it again .. The Aryan Invasion Theory has died a Dog's death .. I am sure you would have heard of the recent Dartmouth conference and the Swastika symbol in Indus Valley Civilization.
By the way you do know what people wrote in 2006 and that means YOU ARE NO NEW TO THIS SITE (Contrary to your claims in the other thread)!!!
I will not be surprised if you turn out to be HIM, eventually .. hehe :)) - It's an old and out-dated tactic :))
Just because you have similar sounding words in 2 languages you cant classify them to be belonging to the same - Going by that logic even Telugu can be classified as a Europen language since rODDu, kaaru, railu are commonly used in Telugu!
Posted by: Malakpet Rowdy At: 16, Dec 2007 10:12:38 PM IST
Ayya Ken Garu,
Naaku ippatiki artam kanidi okkate nandi,
Maanavudi pttupoorvortla gurunchi pustakalao vrasina varu thama jaati gurunchi rayaledu, vallu ekkadinunchi vacharo Bagundandi vallu marachi poyyi vuntaru.
Meeru emmanna cheppagalara?
Mee commenst lo meeru Vedala gurunchi kuda vrasaru anduke adugu tunnanu, meeku telusemo ani.
These are my silly doubts, please try to clirify that..
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 16, Dec 2007 8:09:37 PM IST
Ayya Ken Garu,
U may not believe in Aryan-Dravidian paradigm but scientific community does?
This wrong sentence baabu, there is no scientific evidence; this entire story is based on one Christian priest book Babu.
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 16, Dec 2007 7:47:11 PM IST
CM Garu dorikarndi,
idigOnDi naa MaTa: telugu puTTindE Georgian nunchi,
Nammutara! leda.(YSR style)
Tappakunda nammutaru lendi.Manam Andrulam(Telugu Vallam) kada
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 16, Dec 2007 10:18:10 AM IST
Hi Mr. Ken,
I sthere anything wrong with my comments.
I got confussed about couple points in your comments
'
The article implies that everybody in this world are Telugus or descendents of Telugus.'
Naku A article lo ekkada ayana elannatrlu anipinchaledndi, Ayan first page lone, manavaru etharulato ela sambanda bandvyalu vunnayo cheppatani try chesarani pistondi.
Nake ee artcle lo Arya and Dravida ane padale nammakam galevandi.
1. Telugus were not a known seafarers but Tamils were. It's ONLY becoz of their expeditions to the south east asia we have had the Hindu religion surviving in Baali now. Not only that but the world famous Ankor Vat temples were nothing but the contributions of Tamil kings (& their descendents) and their colonisation of that part of the world.
Please read this link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migration_of_Kambojas#Kambojas_in_Indo-China
From that Ankor Vat /Ankor Wat was not built by Tamilans
Note: If any name ends with n, they may not be tamil.
9. As for Indo-Georgian Historical ties and the etymology mentioned, it’s entirely possible since the region we are talking abt was the region where the people of the orient and occident criss-crossed and therefore one language influencing the other sister languages is not surprising.
This point is contradicts with all other points.
Please let me know if i miss anything in this article.
Please do not get me wrong, please help me to clear u my mind about my Mother language.
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 16, Dec 2007 10:04:16 AM IST
Mr. Ken Veerla gAriki manavi,
mIru wrAsinadAntlo konni ardham kAledu, konchem telugu lo wrAygalarani manavi
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 15, Dec 2007 1:33:36 AM IST
nAku I arTikal kanTe I achcha telugu vaalla kAmenTs naChAYi
Posted by: Mr. Ramesh V At: 15, Dec 2007 1:31:00 AM IST
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